More EU green madness, enforced retrofit?

[isha]

True enough.
But if your house is left in custodian ship of your family members, they can rent it, get an income. Government currently dont give a shite about what buildings tenants go into, so they wont be policing it. family can move into your empty house, and rent out their own.

Thinking outside of the box. opens up all sorts of avenues...

True. But I thought I read somewhere it applies to rented property also?

[kadman]

True. But I thought I read somewhere it applies to rented property also?

I would hazard a guess that the majority of existing rental property comes no where near compliance with existing regs as they now stand. But they will still be allowed to be rented and comply with whatever Housing benefits are allowed. It will be decades before the housing stock comes anywhere near current regulations, if ever.
There will be more to worry about on the housing, compliance before that one.
Ask yourself with all the proposal about off site development for modular housing for emergency use that does not require permission, or need to be compliant.....will this gravy train be allowed to halt with silly things like regulations. I will be long cremated before that arises

[CelticRambler]

Point is people worked to get their homes and should be entitled to realise some wealth out of it. I'm sick of the neo-feudalism which is more and more concentrating wealth in the hands of the very few and devaluing by top down authoritarian laws everything ordinary people gather for their own selves

That's the thing, though. How exactly have people "worked to get their homes" ? For the most part, all they've done is enslave themselves to the civil service or some multinational so that they can endebt themselves to some financial institution so that they can out-bid someone else who has their eye on that nice house that's just come on the market four doors down from a place that sold for 500k last year. They are feeding that very same neo-feudalism ... and then bragging about how well they've done.

When it's only the oul lad or the 'rents still in the home it's not really the family home anymore, is it?

People like to do different things with their house eg downsize and give the excess to the kids as a helping hand to get their deposits on their own places.

Sure amn't I in the same situation myself? I'll be down-sizing from the "family home" part of the property to the chicken shed as soon as I can get it watertight and draught-free. But the main house was bought as a "forever home" in the sense that there is no plan for it ever to be sold to anyone else - at least not for a couple of hundred years. It's there not just for the children, but for their children, and for my siblings and their children too.

And this is the ... added value? that I see - and profit from - all the time in France. Because property prices are so low, and the inherent "wealth" unrealised by selling family homes to make a quick profit, it drastically reduces the property-related component of a whole range of unrelated activities, making the running and insurance costs of those so much lower, making them more accessible to people of limited financial means, making life that bit more fun/enjoyable/qualitatively improved as a result.

[kadman]

Not to mention that getting a good BER cert is something like a visit to the nct...and getting a visual fail/ refusal/ pass.....depending on who is doing the looking. Basically your cert says that your house achieves a certain ability to retain heat, depending on the materials of the building fabric, in laymans terms.
I know engineers who say that its a lucky dip with your rating, it can be assessed with different ratings, with different techs doing the rating. Its a win/win for getting a good rating without forking out the dosh. Scheme has been abused for years by the pro's, and now its a chance for Jon and Judy doe to get even..............

My own house is 250 year old with 24" thick walls with 100mm internal insulation, so i know with minimum bit of extra attic insulation thickness I can achieve a great rating. But if Mr newly graduated engineer assesses on the external build fabric of solid stone with a cursory glance which is what they used to do, then my rating would drop.....and so would he .

Like the building regs.....its never gonna happen, its never going to get enforced, and never going to get policed.. If it was, then we would have no housing stock for us to live in, let alone any immigrants..

[Jack The Stripper]

People have houses at 22-24 degree, 16-17 degree is suffice. A lot of energy maintaining that high temperature so as the ad says turn down the stat.

[Hairy-Joe]

People have houses at 22-24 degree, 16-17 degree is suffice. A lot of energy maintaining that high temperature so as the ad says turn down the stat.

Very true. I know plenty of people that have heating blazing in rooms they do not use

[isha]

the main house was bought as a "forever home" in the sense that there is no plan for it ever to be sold to anyone else - at least not for a couple of hundred years. It's there not just for the children, but for their children, and for my siblings and their children too.

There is a hint of "I'm alright Jacques" off this. It just doesn't accommodate everyone, who will have different needs or viewpoints than you.

From my personal POV we see the house as a generational home, we actually speak of it as the children's home for the future, a place that is remote enough to experience rest and recuperating from the hectic world.

But this is personal and doesn't accommodate many people. Younger adults starting out with a family often buy a starter home that may be more ramshackle or older than what they personally want, because it's more affordable and they can do it up a bit and sell on to buy a bigger family home when they are more on their feet or have better incomes. This is just one example of many possible variations. Those starter homes will be diminished in resale value now.
As will old houses owned by people who want to retire/ downsize. Etc. Etc

Other ways of living besides ones own have to be taken into account.

[isha]

The value of homes should be determined between the seller and the buyer. Not by a federal elite on a crusade to "save the planet". If they want to set present and future building standards, away they go, but retroactive measures that devalue people's houses, regardless of other intrinsic values that say a purchaser might otherwise be willing to pay for, eg location, are I would even say morally unfair.

[isha]

This kind of bureaucracy re people's private goods and activities is on a continuum with eg new regulations that demand people register their pet chickens. Fck off, like. Less government. More individual.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.theguar ... s-bird-flu

[Jack The Stripper]

Maybe people are finally realising that the government don’t want anyone owning private property.

[isha]

No "finally realising" about it. It's been obvious for a while. Bloody dekulakisation by stealth.

[isha]

You won't own a car
You will register your chickens
You stay in your 15 minute zone unless we give you a permit
You won't own a solid fuel stove
You won't eat meat
You won't farm to protect the environment
You won't protest or your bank accounts will be frozen
You won't fly without accruing negative social credit ratings
You won't buy a drafty old heap in the country
You won't sell your drafty old heap without fines
You won't have unions
You won't have privacy
You won't travel, go to university, or work unless you take this trial genetic therapy

Etc etc


Slow boil frogs.

[Jack The Stripper]

Something has to be done to prioritise and house the flood of social migrants. Remember they are Irelands first class citizens now.

[CelticRambler]

Younger adults starting out with a family often buy a starter home that may be more ramshackle or older than what they personally want, because it's more affordable and they can do it up a bit and sell on to buy a bigger family home when they are more on their feet or have better incomes.

Well my personal opinion is that the concept of a "starter home" that you trade up successively as your needs change is at the root of the problem. Growing up in 70s/80s Ireland, there was never any discussion of "starter homes" - you rented a flat till you figured out what kind of an adult life you were going to lead, then you bought a house as a permanent residence and that was the end of it.

At the end of the 80s, I was taking an active interest in the property market and saw that across the water, one of the biggest headaches for buyers wasn't so much the price of the property in which they were interested, but The Chain, where every buyer was dependent on a seller who was themselves a buyer and dependent on another seller, who was also trying to buy their way up the property ladder. That was very much an English thing at the time, but when I considered coming back to Ireland in the 00s, I found it had become a firmly established Irish (Dublin?) "tradition" by then too - complete with the expectation of making a hefty profit on the re-sale of the house one had owned for a few years (if even that).

In the forty years since, I have never come across a good socio-economic argument for trading property as frequently as is done in the UK, the US and now Ireland. But hey, the government gets to slap a load of stamp duty on each transaction, and the banks provide easy money to help exaggerate the prices, and should anyone think it's a good idea to foist new rules and obligations onto property owners, what better time to do it than at the point of sale-and-purchase.

The more ordinary householders buy in to the idea that their house is an investment and behave like traders on the stock exchange, the less they can complain about stuff like this.

I have the advantage of counting a fair number of twenty-somethings in my entourage, living in Ireland, the UK, France and Benelux-Germany. The continentals are already at the stage of being able to afford proper family-sized homes with enough spare cash and holidays to be able to enjoy life to the full; the Irish are chasing full-time permanent jobs so as to be able to pay at least three times as much for one of these infamous "starter homes"; while the UKists are stuck in rented accommodation with massive council tax bills and little prospect of ever owning a property of their own.

[Hairy-Joe]

I am also fascinated by people saying "oh my house has gone up by €X thousand". I never understood that. Unless you are planning on selling and not living in a house, the "profit" from rising prices is meaningless to you.

I am planning on staying where I am until I'm carried out in a box so the value of the home is meaningless as I'm not planning on selling.

[isha]

I'm glad my parents moved on from their starter home as my growing up experience in the 70s was that the house I lived in until I was about 7 (by then with four younger siblings) had a chemical loo in the shed and all of us kids packed into one bedroom squabbling.

But I do take the point that houses for investment/money making does contribute to a heated market.

I think there is an in between position that is more reasonable.

[isha]

It's kind of weird for me, a hippie with basically zero financial clout, arguing in favour of people being able to sell and buy their houses/property as they feel like because that's like freedom, man, and finding that the push back is that almost any house buying, besides your forever home that you will hole up in until you die, is some kind of psycho-capitalism. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills

[nlgbbbblth]

Just remember it wasn't Fianna Fail or Fine Gael that said "all property is theft"

[marhay70]

Just remember it wasn't Fianna Fail or Fine Gael that said "all property is theft"

That might be because, in this country, between all their cronies and business "associates", they own most of it.