Our push to EV when others in Europe aren't - why?

[Hairy-Joe]

I've just driven from Cherbourg to Irun in Spain, going through the entire length of France and I've just wondered why we are pushing for EV when other countries are not.

For the entire journey through France, I spotted one EV (a Leaf) outside Nantes. I expected to see some in the larger cities but spotted none around Bordeaux.

Also, whats telling is the complete lack of (obvious) charging stations. I obviously pulled into several services stations and rest area and didn't see one charging point. From exploring several towns, I didn't see any charging stations in car parks either.

In Spain I've not seen one EV and I've read that sales of EV's in Germany are far below our sales in percentage terms.

I am wondering whether we are WAY ahead of the curve or have other countries seen something we haven't?

[peasant]

Might have something to do with the fact that other European countries are not as obsessed with driving the newest plate as we are.

Their fleet turnaround is much slower, they hold on to their cars for longer.

And when you look at at it, other than the first gen Leaf, EV's are a fairly new thing. It's only ...what ...three or four years or so that there is a bit of a choice of useable electric vehicles ?

[CelticRambler]

Am a bit surprised you didn't see either EVs or charging points on a run through France, as I'd see (or rather not hear) the vehicles pretty much every time I go to any urban area. Am completely useless at recognising car shapes when driving, so couldn't tell you how many pass me on a long-distance drive.

As for charging points - they're everywhere. Every supermarket carpark, every out-of-town shopping centre, every two-bit village with notions and/or a camper stopping point.

It's possible that on the route you took, you wouldn't have seen them because the (relatively) low limit on their autonomy makes them unattractive for continentals who do long distances all the time. My usual "commute" is 600km but there'd be some people who'd do 900km or even 1200km in a day, often as a duo, swapping drivers to save time. Charging time is a serious limitation in that regard, and that's before you factor in the risk of finding the most suitable charging point is already occupied. It's a totally different situation in urban areas, though.

[dawg]

I believe that Holland is lousy with them yokes.

In Norway ( not EU ) it seems most new car sales are EV ( funny that, considering the amount of oil that country produces ).

What Peasant says above is very much the case - a car lasting 30+ years is not unusual in most of Europe.

[Hairy-Joe]

Hey CR, I went Cherbourg to Nantes, La Rochelle, Bordeaux and then Autoroute to Irun. I stopped in Marans at a supermarket and saw no chargers there.

What I found more interesting was on the Autoroutes, at the Aires I saw no chargers. I stopped in both service station ones and non service station ones.

[Hairy-Joe]

Hey Mr P, the age of the car fleet has something to do with it alright. Peugeot 106 are quite common here whereas that's almost vintage at home. I saw some of those old Renault Express vans in daily service along with one old Peugeot 404 pickup being used on a farm.

Ya I reckon if we got rid of the year off our plates, the obsession with new cars would diminish, thereby reducing the emissions from new car production. The taxman mightn't like it though.

[CelticRambler]

What I found more interesting was on the Autoroutes, at the Aires I saw no chargers. I stopped in both service station ones and non service station ones.

Hmm. I think you might not have been looking in the right place - have just checked on a few of the motorway manager sites, and there are hundreds of them at the service station aires. It could be the signage that's not clear - I reckon there are probably at least half a dozen different brands that you might come across, and if you're not tuned in to the brand and shape, the bornes could be hard to pick out in the confusion of all the other forecourt furniture.

At the simple picnic area aires I wouldn't be surprised if they were scarcer. Facilities there tend to be of the non-maintenance kind, and the majority of people who use them don't stop for long, so the cost-benefit equation wouldn't be great for the management company. If the car is going to be immobilised for half an hour, they'd want you to be spending money in a shop or restaurant during that time!

[Wibbs]

Hey Mr P, the age of the car fleet has something to do with it alright. Peugeot 106 are quite common here whereas that's almost vintage at home. I saw some of those old Renault Express vans in daily service along with one old Peugeot 404 pickup being used on a farm.

Ya I reckon if we got rid of the year off our plates, the obsession with new cars would diminish, thereby reducing the emissions from new car production. The taxman mightn't like it though.

Neither would SIMI, the government and the lending institutions, which includes the insurance industry. That's what's behind the new car buzz here in Ireland. It's got near zero to do with "green concerns" That and for many people in Ireland it's not much more than a generation ago where even buying an old junker wasn't really an option. For much of the history of the state much, if not most of the population had little extra cash to spend. That dopamine hit of the new is pretty cultural with us. We also went from a largely rural and inner city urban society to a sprawling suburban one and the latter is the perfect twitching windows breeding ground for social oneupmanship. The new Beemer on tick in the drive ticks the boxes and increasingly the Leaf, Tesla et al really does the trick.

[Cyclepath]

Neither would SIMI, the government and the lending institutions, which includes the insurance industry. That's what's behind the new car buzz here in Ireland. It's got near zero to do with "green concerns" That and for many people in Ireland it's not much more than a generation ago where even buying an old junker wasn't really an option. For much of the history of the state much, if not most of the population had little extra cash to spend. That dopamine hit of the new is pretty cultural with us. We also went from a largely rural and inner city urban society to a sprawling suburban one and the latter is the perfect twitching windows breeding ground for social oneupmanship. The new Beemer on tick in the drive ticks the boxes and increasingly the Leaf, Tesla et al really does the trick.

Agree, I'm just back from France in my 12 year old car. In Ireland it's getting on a bit but in France it's relatively young. There are loads of Citroen Saxos, Xantias, Peugeot 104s, 404s etc - all are well maintained and passing their annual Controle Technique. I even saw several mint Renault 4s going about.

We're obsessed with status symbols in this country. We want to be rich as opposed to wealthy.

[CelticRambler]

All these gubusies in France and not a one of ye dropped in to see me.

Or bring me a load of tea-bags.

[dawg]

Despite state grants in many countries EVs are still expensive and so are not an option for many.

Thats not to say that people dont want to own them

Why would anyone buy one ?

(a) Many EVs are very nice to drive
(b) Some EVs are 'leave a Ferrari in the dust' fast. Some find this appealing.

As an aside, many in RoI lose sight of the relative prosperity of the country within EU

[Hairy-Joe]

All these gubusies in France and not a one of ye dropped in to see me.

Or bring me a load of tea-bags.

Well, I don't drink tea so sorry!

[Hairy-Joe]

Well CR, I should have called. I saw 37C on the outside temperature gauge yesterday around Bordeaux. The fridge on the camper decided to call it a day and stopped cooling. I guess the temperature has gone too high. It's now "only" 29C and it's still not back cooling.....

[Hairy-Joe]

I'm here in Burgos in Spain and I'm still on the EV hunt. Spotted none today on the journey from Irun to Burgos.

I must be looking in the wrong places, but it's a Mecca for old car spotters. Renault 11 & 4L anyone?

[dawg]

I'm here in Burgos in Spain and I'm still on the EV hunt....

IME most EVs in Spain are owned by state bodies.
Chargers are carefully located with the compounds of said bodies.
The Spanish know how to run things

[Peregrinus]

According to the Wikipedia page on EV use by country, in 2020 sales of EVs represented 11.2% of all sales in France, but EVs were only 1.29% of all cars in use.

The Wikipedia page doesn't give 2020 figures for Ireland, but lower down on the same page suggests that in 2019 EVS represented 2.4% of sales.

The figures may not be directly comparable - it's not clear whether either sales figure is a percentage of car sales, or of all vehicle sales, for example, and the answer may be different for the two figures, and similarly hybrids may be differently treated in the two figures - and of course they are from different years in what is a rapidly developing market. But, for what it's worth, there's nothing there to suggest that France is behind Ireland in embracing les véhicules électriques.

[Cyclepath]

All these gubusies in France and not a one of ye dropped in to see me.

Or bring me a load of tea-bags.

I was on the ile de Noirmoutier, what region are you in?! Brought loadsa tea bags too

[CelticRambler]

I was on the ile de Noirmoutier, what region are you in?! Brought loadsa tea bags too

Right in the middle - easy distance of everywhere else! (And yes, that was a deliberate choice )

The Branle de Noirmoutier is a great dance, that I will forever associate with Middle-Eastern jihadis! Was at a festival some years ago and received a video from one of the children showing a bunch of bearded gunmen doing some kind of coordinated celebration, involving much firing in the air and shouting Allllllaaaaaaaaaaaah Akhbar. By a fluke of nature (or divine intervention?) the video played in perfect synch with the live performance in front of me. Can't look at those guys now or hear them invoke their deity without imagining them doing the Branle!

[Hairy-Joe]

Hey CR. I found an old box of Lyons Tea Bags in the back of the press in the camper. I don't use them so I don't know how old they are. I'll be going back through France from Spain in a few weeks. I won't insult you by trying to pass off the old tea bags on you.

Oh, also, on the EV spotting front, no joy today......

[CelticRambler]

Hey CR. I found an old box of Lyons Tea Bags in the back of the press in the camper. I don't use them so I don't know how old they are. I'll be going back through France from Spain in a few weeks. I won't insult you by trying to pass off the old tea bags on you.

Insult me! Insult me!

[Cyclepath]

Right in the middle - easy distance of everywhere else! (And yes, that was a deliberate choice )

The Branle de Noirmoutier is a great dance, that I will forever associate with Middle-Eastern jihadis! Was at a festival some years ago and received a video from one of the children showing a bunch of bearded gunmen doing some kind of coordinated celebration, involving much firing in the air and shouting Allllllaaaaaaaaaaaah Akhbar. By a fluke of nature (or divine intervention?) the video played in perfect synch with the live performance in front of me. Can't look at those guys now or hear them invoke their deity without imagining them doing the Branle!

Erm, Am I right in thinking the word 'branle' is wank in french?!
If so, this is one dance I may be able to do in a reasonably coordinated fashion unlike any other dancing I attempt

[CelticRambler]

Erm, Am I right in thinking the word 'branle' is wank in french?!
If so, this is one dance I may be able to do in a reasonably coordinated fashion unlike any other dancing I attempt

Ah, the joys of reflexive verbs!

Funnily enough, it's a dance that frequently freaks out those of a testosterone-fuelled masturbatory disposition new to the world of trad dance, because (if one respects tradition) all the men line up on one side, all the women on the other and, mon Dieu, sacrebleu!, the men hold hands!

But listen, I think we're getting a bit off topic here - it's the ladies that more commonly use EVs in that regard, isn't it?

[Peregrinus]

Erm, Am I right in thinking the word 'branle' is wank in french?!
If so, this is one dance I may be able to do in a reasonably coordinated fashion unlike any other dancing I attempt

Not that co-ordinated, I think. Branler means to wobble, to shake, to be unsteady. The reflexive form, se branler, means to masturbate — I guess because you're wobbling your bits, or perhaps because masturbating makes you a bit wobbly. Either way, the expression doesn't suggest a great degree of co-ordination.

[Peregrinus]

Not that co-ordinated, I think. Branler means to wobble, to shake, to be unsteady. The reflexive form, se branler, means to masturbate — I guess because you're wobbling your bits, or perhaps because masturbating makes you a bit wobbly. Either way, the expression doesn't suggest a great degree of co-ordination.

How did we get onto this from discussing electric vehicles?

[CelticRambler]

Serious question: is there any demographic analysis of whether EVs are more commonly used now by males or females? One hundred years ago, the first EVs were dealt a fatal blow by being seen as a woman's car - Real Men wouldn't stoop so low as to use a push-button starter when they could stoop even lower to crank the engine by hand. And a noisy engine was as much an expression of ones testosterone levels and the length of ones moustaches (still the case in some quarters ... )

In these more modern times, have EVs become a must-have gadget for mid-life men, are they a handy low-cost runabout for the little woman at home, or have they become a genuinely viable, mainstream choice by mainstream new-car purchasers regardless of demographic background?