Gaelscoileanna for the French!

[CelticRambler]

In other parts of the cyberworld, some people get very worked up about the viability of the Irish language, and the resources devoted to perpetuating it. Well, new for this school year is a programme of primary education through Alsatian for a few lucky children living in Alsace.

Just four schools at the moment, and only for the youngest children (3-4 years old) - but that's quite revolutionary for this country, where regional languages were (literally) beaten out of children only one hundred years ago. 75% of the teaching is/will be done through German and Alsatian, 25% through French.

When I first started working over there, I was surprised at how much of the language was still spoken, even if it's only in the form of random words and phrases that crop up in ordinary conversation - kinda like Irish people talking about their geansaí or their leaba.

[Del.Monte]

Ah more proof that I'm only a blow-in as I would never say geansaí or leaba - only here since Oliver came calling.

[Setanta]

I'd love to see every student,who wants it,have a gaurantee to have their education through Irish ...like the Catalans have

[Del.Monte]

I'd love to see every student,who wants it,have a gaurantee to have their education through Irish ...like the Catalans have

I suspect it's a small number of parents rather than students who would choose to have their education through Irish. Indeed, I have never met anybody who expressed such a desire when I was at school or since leaving it. Irish is fine in the Gaeltacht I'm sure but as for wasting yet more money on it ...

[Setanta]

I suspect it's a small number of parents rather than students who would choose to have their education through Irish. Indeed, I have never met anybody who expressed such a desire when I was at school or since leaving it. Irish is fine in the Gaeltacht I'm sure but as for wasting yet more money on it ...

How ever small the number is,it should be gauramteed right for any child/parent that wants it all the same

The growth of gaelscoils,is surely proof of an underlying demand for it....build it and they will come,an ability to speak Irish functionally,is like any other education,no weight to carry

[CelticRambler]

I suspect it's a small number of parents rather than students who would choose to have their education through Irish. Indeed, I have never met anybody who expressed such a desire when I was at school or since leaving it. Irish is fine in the Gaeltacht I'm sure but as for wasting yet more money on it ...

My brother sent his three to a Gaelscoil primary in south county Dublin. They would have continued on into secondary, but there weren't enough places available. From what I've heard through the family grapevine, all the gaelscoileanna within about 50km of the capital are oversubscribed, so more are being brought on line every year.

Funnily enough, almost exactly the same arguments are being put forward for the Alsatian equivalents: children learning ordinary subjects through a second language consistently come out ahead of their peers. How true that is in the grand scheme of things, I can't be sure, but I do know that my children, learning through French instead of English, were top of their respective classes.

[Del.Monte]

My brother sent his three to a Gaelscoil primary in south county Dublin. They would have continued on into secondary, but there weren't enough places available. From what I've heard throught he family grapevine, all the gaelscoileanna within about 50km of the capital are oversubscribed, so more are being brought on line every year.

Funnily enough, almost exactly the same arguments are being put forward for the Alsatian equivalents: children learning ordinary subjects through a second language consistently come out ahead of their peers. How true that is in the grand scheme of things, I can't be sure, but I do know that my children, learning through French instead of English, were top of their respective classes.

There are other factors that also account for the popularity of Gaelscoils apart from the difficulty in finding any school these days - ethnicity being one. Anyway far too much money has and will be wasted on the wretched language. I remember hearing a well known 'republican' being quoted as saying that the one good thing that Brits did for Ireland was to kill off the Irish language. Don't know where said individual is these days but probably in some motorway foundations....

[Banshee]

Both of my parents were educated to the primary certificate ( 14 years) through the language of Irish. They had no choice. Both of them were born in Ireland in 1936. They only language they spoke was english but they were forced to be educated through Irish. Yes their parents were allowed to home school them but on both sides they were non irish in origin, speaking english natively.

When my mother emigrated to england, she experienced the freedom and empowerment of being able to look up a word in the english dictionary. Her period of emigration gave her freedom that Ireland denied to her - even though her family had won war of independence medals for Ireland.

Both my parents were disadvantaged by being forced to be educated in a language that no one spoke.

The French are ruthless abut speaking french so we need to learn from the french to be ruthless about speaking Irish. The welsh aren't far behind the french, and it stands to them.

[Banshee]

My mother came home, I was conceived, born and raised here but if my mother hadn't emigrated she wouldn't have been able to teach me the english dictionary.

[Del.Monte]

Both of my parents were educated to the primary certificate ( 14 years) through the language of Irish. They had no choice. Both of them were born in Ireland in 1936. They only language they spoke was english but they were forced to be educated through Irish. Yes their parents were allowed to home school them but on both sides they were non irish in origin, speaking english natively.

When my mother emigrated to england, she experienced the freedom and empowerment of being able to look up a word in the english dictionary. Her period of emigration gave her freedom that Ireland denied to her - even though her family had won war of independence medals for Ireland.

Both my parents were disadvantaged by being forced to be educated in a language that no one spoke.

The French are ruthless abut speaking french so we need to learn from the french to be ruthless about speaking Irish. The welsh aren't far behind the french, and it stands to them.

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say as you seem to resent your parents being forced to learn Irish and yet you want the country to "be ruthless" about speaking Irish? In case you haven't noticed a lot of people (at least 20%) of the population were born outside the country, we have god knows how many asylum seekers, Ukrainians etc. plus a substantial number of non-Roman Catholics who would have no tradition of Irish speaking - i.e. not their native tongue.

[Banshee]

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say as you seem to resent your parents being forced to learn Irish and yet you want the country to "be ruthless" about speaking Irish? In case you haven't noticed a lot of people (at least 20%) of the population were born outside the country, we have god knows how many asylum seekers, Ukrainians etc. plus a substantial number of non-Roman Catholics who would have no tradition of Irish speaking - i.e. not their native tongue.

I concerned that your post has more than a touch of racism/hatred talk against persons who live in Ireland who were not born here.

[Banshee]

I am happy that my parents were expected to learn Irish. The issue is that they were forced to learn all the other subjects /skills through that language in which they were not fluent and which they both informed me that this was an impediment to their learning. I was responding to the first post in this thread by Celtic Rambler. That the alsace children 100 years ago had french beaten into them /alsace beaten out of them was the reverse to my parents primary level education/training where they were having the english beaten out / Gaelige beaten into them.
Thankfully the world of education and training is much more progressive now. !

[PureIsle]

My forever gripe is the way I was taught Irish.
It was taught only for the purpose of passing an examination, concentrating on words/verbs/gender thereof and so on. Purely technical.
Of course I hated it and had little understanding of what I was regurgitating.

IF, we had been taught to speak Irish to communicate, that would have been a completely different type of teaching and learning. It would likely also have produced somebody with the ability to speak my native language.

I had a terrible time when preparing for my leaving cert. where the classes for Maths were given through English, but the only 'approved' text book was in the Irish language, which proved completely useless to me. I did manage to overcome that disadvantage.

All of the above is to say ... I believe that Irish should be taught to everyone, but done for conversational purposes.
For those who wish to study Irish for examination purposes then they should be provided with the opportunity to study advanced Irish from a 'technical' aspect.
For those who wish to do all subjects through Irish, I would ask why, unless their first language is Irish. Extra points for taking a subject through Irish (is that still a thing?) should be abolished.

IMO, Irish is a wonderful language, but for goodness sakes take the pressure off and let people speak it as best they can, without recriminations or pressure.
Let the language live again.

[Del.Monte]

I concerned that your post has more than a touch of racism/hatred talk against persons who live in Ireland who were not born here.

And I'm concerned that this post is labelling anyone concerned with the direction that are country is going in is a racist. I don't see any hatred in my post and I was simply pointing out that Irish is not the native language of a sizeable, and growing, percentage of the population. Incidentally, I wasn't born in Ireland.

[marhay70]

In Wales, particularly Northern Wales which is less Anglified, the Welsh language lives on alongside English. This is where I would like to see Irish. It is ridiculous and self defeating to expect Irish ever to become the first language of the country again and I would fight tooth and nail against it, It has no useful purpose, except as a relic of bygone days, nice to have and look back on but really just romanticism..
Most countries in Europe promote English as their second language and it is no surprise to go into any retail establishment and have a conversation with the staff in English. This is realism, they still keep their national tongue but accept that English is the language of commerce and it is imperative to have it. We are lucky, in this respect, how many multi national companies would have set up in Ireland, a windswept, rain sodden island on the very far fringe of Europe, if English was not the first language.