Vaccine megathread

[isha]

80% according to Schmettil's analysis of last months HSE figures. One of you is wrong hence I didn't read the rest of your post.

Course you didn't. Anything that does not fit your vision is unbearable.

[isha]

Nope, my analysis did not prove they were 120 times more likely. You butchered the figures and came up with that nonsense; neatly showing once again that you have no understanding of the figures.

Yes, that was a piece of weirdness, that butchering.

[isha]

You're surprised at it because you spend too much time sitting on the toilet flicking through facebook watching nurse Campbell underline stuff he's found online and dumbed down as much as he can. Read some proper studies. Analyse figures more yourself. Stop listening to Isha and her like. You might be surprised a bit more.

I don't know how this constant trope of yours that the people with whom you debate are dumbed down idiots sitting on toilets does not simply amount to you being a dick.

[Scotty]

And yet there are still morons out there that think these vaccines work.

showing once again that you have no understanding of the figures.

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

[schmittel]

Striking indeed, and yet vaccines don't work.

You're surprised at it because you spend too much time sitting on the toilet flicking through facebook watching nurse Campbell underline stuff he's found online and dumbed down as much as he can. Read some proper studies. Analyse figures more yourself. Stop listening to Isha and her like. You might be surprised a bit more.

You know exactly why I was surprised, because the next sentence that you conveniently omitted to include in what you quoted, explained exactly why:

In fairness to the vaccine it is striking that of the non underlying conditions 27/30 or 90% of them are unvaccinated, clearly showing that if you have no underlying conditions the vaccine is working at reducing your likelihood to end up in ICU. I was surprised at this. based n the UK figures I expected this to be fairly evenly split between vexed and unvaxxed.

[Scotty]

So 76 of 148 in ICU were unvaccinated (51%) despite the unvaccinated making up only 5% of the population.
5 of every 100 over twelve's are taking up 51 of every 100 ICU beds occupied.

Even on just the case numbers, 29,662 unvaccinated out of 80,616 cases. That's over 36%!!!!

1 out of every 3 cases were from unvaccinated people despite only 1 in 20 of the population being unvaccinated!

That's conclusive evidence that those who can but won't get vaccinated are causing an enormous strain on the heath service and risking us all going into lockdown. It also makes it easy to understand why governments and administrations around the world are mandating people to vaccinate where take up is low.

[isha]

So 76 of 148 were unvaccinated (51%) despite the unvaccinated making up only 5% of the population.
5 of every 100 over twelve's are taking up 51 of every 100 ICU beds.

Even on just the case numbers, 29,662 unvaccinated out of 80,616 cases. That's over 36%. 1 out of every 3 cases were from unvaccinated people despite only 1 in 20 of the population being unvaccinated!

Go on, tell me how the vaccines are not working, tell me how the unvaccinated aren't the problem...

You are obviously not registering the very important part of the reckoning which is that the vast majority of the unvaccinated in hospital ICUs have underlying conditions, many of which underlying conditions may preclude them from receiving a vaccine. 91% of deaths in Oct-Nov had underlying conditions.
You want to be part of the ludicrous scare-mongering faction that is pushing the notion that healthy unvaccinated people are being put into ICUs and dying in numbers from Covid, when this is completely false. And this false narrative is being used to support tyranny.
It is actually bizarre that this is the picture many want to present.

The healthy unvaccinated may in fact be working as a dampener on a pandemic by building broad-spectrum natural immunity against the 4 proteins of SARS COV 2, while vaccinees vaccine-acquired antibodies against the spike protein may be encouraging selective mutation pressures on the spike protein of the virus.

And having made an effort to look at the charts, presumably while you are seated on your toilet as you mention it so often I cannot help but place you there, you will not have failed to note the Case Fatality Rate, which is no more than Influenza. Note - not all cases are recorded so CFR is actually lower than on the chart. For this people like you want to inject a trial substance into every single person, now from 5 years old up, regardless of whether they want it or not.

I dunno, call me a liberal, but I don't believe in that kind of Vaxism.

[Guburnor]

You're surprised at it because you spend too much time sitting on the toilet flicking through facebook watching nurse Campbell underline stuff he's found online and dumbed down as much as he can. Read some proper studies. Analyse figures more yourself. Stop listening to Isha and her like. You might be surprised a bit more.

Please remember not to be a dick. Thanks.

[isha]

Great news for global Vaxism and Vaxists everywhere. Upcoming Omicron vax will be a 3 dose regime. But get your Alpha variant booster first now and quickly, because for some reason it also helps. Imprinting or Original Antigenic Sin, be damned.

[Scotty]

You are obviously not registering the very important part of the reckoning which is that the vast majority of the unvaccinated in hospital ICUs have underlying conditions, many of which underlying conditions may preclude them from receiving a vaccine.

According to Schmittel's figures last month, of the 83 unvaccinated in ICU, 27 had no pre existing. That's 32% or 1 in 3. Not insignificant.

I heard Paul Reid or someone say on the radio last week that 58,000 people were advised NOT to get the vaccine. I think that leaves about 200,000 who still could but haven't.

I'm not suggesting anyone who shouldn't be vaccinated be vaccinated.

91% of deaths in Oct-Nov had underlying conditions.
You want to be part of the ludicrous scare-mongering faction that is pushing the notion that healthy unvaccinated people are being put into ICUs and dying in numbers from Covid, when this is completely false. And this false narrative is being used to support tyranny.

I haven't really mentioned deaths at all and certainly never mentioned anything about dying in numbers. I see the vaccine as a tool to prevent lockdowns and illness, not so much to prevent deaths. As you say, deaths are mostly people well beyond life expectancy or people with serious medical conditions to begin with anyway.

It's a very very small proportion of the population who see any of this as tyranny. No one has been forced to take the vaccine in this country and yet 95% of those who could have, did. We're the envy of lots of health services around the world.

And having made an effort to look at the charts, presumably while you are seated on your toilet as you mention it so often I cannot help but place you there, you will not have failed to note the Case Fatality Rate, which is no more than Influenza.

Again, I don't see the vaccines as a tool for preventing deaths. They're about reducing case numbers and serious illness and to allow us to lift lockdowns. I think if it weren't for vaccines we'd still be in lockdown with no prospect of them lifting. Just imagine that scenario!!

[kadman]

According to Schmittel's figures last month, of the 83 unvaccinated in ICU, 27 had no pre existing. That's 32% or 1 in 3. Not insignificant.

I heard Paul Reid or someone say on the radio last week that 58,000 people were advised NOT to get the vaccine. I think that leaves about 200,000 who still could but haven't.

I'm not suggesting anyone who shouldn't be vaccinated be vaccinated.

I haven't really mentioned deaths at all and certainly never mentioned anything about dying in numbers. I see the vaccine as a tool to prevent lockdowns and illness, not so much to prevent deaths. As you say, deaths are mostly people well beyond life expectancy or people with serious medical conditions to begin with anyway.

It's a very very small proportion of the population who see any of this as tyranny. No one has been forced to take the vaccine in this country and yet 95% of those who could have, did. We're the envy of lots of health services around the world.

Again, I don't see the vaccines as a tool for preventing deaths. They're about reducing case numbers and serious illness and to allow us to lift lockdowns. I think if it weren't for vaccines we'd still be in lockdown with no prospect of them lifting. Just imagine that scenario!!

So presumably these 58,000 who were not vaccinated, become unvaccinated along with the sanctions against them, or do they get an exempted cert ??

[Banshee Bones]

So maccers has had to soften his cough on Mandatory Vaccines in French West Indes, unfortunately these people have bitter experience of Trusting The Science and arent buying into it again

https://www.france24.com/en/americas/20 ... the-crisis

[Scotty]

So presumably these 58,000 who were not vaccinated, become unvaccinated along with the sanctions against them, or do they get an exempted cert ??

Er no, they get a death cert.


If we fail to keep up with vaccination and or lockdown to keep numbers at bay then we are condemning anyone in the country who is immuno compromised.

[Scotty]

Just looking at your chart again Isha, am I seeing things or did 10% of all unvaccinated adults in the country test positive for Covid in those 4 weeks? 29,662.... out of what, 250k-300k? And they're only the ones that were tested!

[kadman]

Er no, they get a death cert.


If we fail to keep up with vaccination and or lockdown to keep numbers at bay then we are condemning anyone in the country who is immuno compromised.

Read the post, they were advised not to get the vaccine, they didn't refuse, they were advised.

[Supercell]

Anti Vaxers, heres an article describing what may await some of you - https://www.theguardian.com/society/202 ... obal-en-GB , is a tiny pin prick really worse than this?

[isha]

Anti Vaxers, heres an article describing what may await some of you - https://www.theguardian.com/society/202 ... obal-en-GB , is a tiny pin prick really worse than this?

Look at the bright side, Supercell. Every time this happens
1) you will be right
And
2) there will be one less of us vaccine-free people to annoy you on here

[Scotty]

Just looking at your chart again Isha, am I seeing things or did 10% of all unvaccinated adults in the country test positive for Covid in those 4 weeks? 29,662.... out of what, 250k-300k? And they're only the ones that were tested!

This would totally justify the covid passport too btw, if the disease is that rampant within the unvaxxed they should really be under much stricter restrictions than they currently are.

[kadman]

Unvaccinated and vaccinated carry and transmit covid, in case you think its the unvaccinated only.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/29/heal ... ssion.html

The recommendation that vaccinated people in some parts of the country dust off their masks was based largely on one troublesome finding, according to Dr. Rochelle Walensky, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

New research showed that vaccinated people infected with the Delta variant carry tremendous amounts of the virus in the nose and throat, she said in an email responding to questions from The New York Times.

The finding contradicts what scientists had observed in vaccinated people infected with previous versions of the virus, who mostly seemed incapable of infecting others.

That conclusion dealt Americans a heavy blow: People with so-called breakthrough infections — cases that occur despite full vaccination — of the Delta variant may be just as contagious as unvaccinated people, even if they have no symptoms.

That means fully immunized people with young children, aging parents, or friends and family with weak immune systems will need to renew vigilance, particularly in high-transmission communities. Vaccinated Americans may need to wear masks not just to protect themselves, but everyone in their orbit.

[isha]

It's amazing we are alive at all, what with so many of us catching it, apparently dying of it and bearing up under the present weight of jackboots and the sweet sweet promises of more punishment to come.
Tough crowd, us vaccine free - very hard to bate us down.

[Banshee Bones]

This would totally justify the covid passport too btw, if the disease is that rampant within the unvaxxed they should really be under much stricter restrictions than they currently are.

Thats would be fair enough, if the overweight and elderly were under the same restrictions, but sure following the science won't extend to that eh?

[Scotty]

Unvaccinated and vaccinated carry and transmit covid, in case you think its the unvaccinated only.

That's research from last July. Studies since then have shown that the vaccinated viral loads are faster to peak and faster to diminish making the vaccinated transmissible for much shorter a time than those unvaccinated.

The latest figures from the HSE which Isha posted yesterday support this. Only 1 in 20 of the population are unvaccinated yet 1 in 3 of all cases are from unvaccinated. Not deaths, not ICU admissions, not serious illness, just plain cases. That's an enormous difference! And it's not like it was from a small pool. That's out of 80,000 cases.

The only possible conclusion is that the vaccines are extremely effective at reducing the transmission of covid. There's no other possible explanation. And remember, the vaccinated are socialising and mingling much more than the unvaccinated too making them even more susceptible again to picking up covid.

Figures like these make it easy to see why governments are imposing vaccine mandates and really, it makes it hard to argue against them.

[isha]

Worth remembering that the people with hard ons for vaccine mandates have children from.5 years up and soon likely from infancy in their needle sights also.

And also worth repeating ad nauseum that healthy unvaccinated people are not a problem, for anyone or for any system. They are not forming the patient groups in ICUs. Or in morgues.

[Banshee Bones]

That's research from last July. Studies since then have shown that the vaccinated viral loads are faster to peak and faster to diminish making the vaccinated transmissible for much shorter a time than those unvaccinated.

The latest figures from the HSE which Isha posted yesterday support this. Only 1 in 20 of the population are unvaccinated yet 1 in 3 of all cases are from unvaccinated. Not deaths, not ICU admissions, not serious illness, just plain cases. That's an enormous difference! And it's not like it was from a small pool. That's out of 80,000 cases.

The only possible conclusion is that the vaccines are extremely effective at reducing the transmission of covid. There's no other possible explanation. And remember, the vaccinated are socialising and mingling much more than the unvaccinated too making them even more susceptible again to picking up covid.

Figures like these make it easy to see why governments are imposing vaccine mandates and really, it makes it hard to argue against them.

Those unvaccinated sure are working overtime spreading covid so, its impressive when you consider how many of them are so old and infirm that they can't be vaccinated

Or its possible the vaccinations doesnt actually do much reduce transmission...like those old fashioned vaccines used to.

[Cyclepath]

And also worth repeating ad nauseum that healthy unvaccinated people are not a problem, for anyone or for any system. They are not forming the patient groups in ICUs. Or in morgues.

This is true. Although I may disagree with some folks on whether or not you should get vaccinated (I'm triple vaxxed) I thoroughly support the right of individuals not to get vaxxed.

I also support the right of private concerns to accept or deny access based on vaccination status. What I don't agree with is the withdrawal of public services from people that chose not to get vaccinated. As Banshee already pointed out - where does that end? Do we refuse cancer treatment to smokers or heart surgery to overweight folks?

I think there's a huge absence of personal responsibility and personal risk assessment among the populace. People seem to want the blame the government for everything and have them take responsibility for a virus we're spreading among ourselves.

I chose to get vaccinated based on a personal risk assessment. My age and a relatively benign heart condition would make me a prime candidate for blocking a hospital bed (no need to thank me ) The only thing I would say is that catching Covid is a shit way to find out you had an underlying susceptibility.

But I think this is all a bit like Brexit - we need to find a way to have uncomfortable conversations with respect and without animosity. When this is all over, we still need to be able to live together!