Anyone still glued to this?

[Setanta]

Into the same pockets as all the rest.
The number and value of foreign assets individuals connected with the Ukr regime have acquired might be an indication.

I don't particularly trust the russian leaning propaganda either,so intend upon keeping an eye on this situation,as perhaps the defences been built on better,more suitable terrain

[Setanta]

Russia has been brought to negociation table for ceasefire

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/pu ... 024-05-24/



Leftists,NAFO clowns,and establishment hacks across Europe, who screamed down anyone who suggested negociated peace settlements sigh in disbelief and are going to have to justify continuing a war that is at effective stalemate with over 12 months,with tens of thousands dying for minimal gains on either side

[PureIsle]

Russia has been brought to negociation table for ceasefire

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/pu ... 024-05-24/



Leftists,NAFO clowns,and establishment hacks across Europe, who screamed down anyone who suggested negociated peace settlements sigh in disbelief and are going to have to justify continuing a war that is at effective stalemate with over 12 months,with tens of thousands dying for minimal gains on either side

It does not look like stalemate to me.
Russia has taken multiple villages & towns in the recent past and do not appear to be stopping.
In addition dues to manpower shortages, Ukr has redeployed forces from Southern regions to the North to hold the Ru advance.
That might well make the Southern regions vulnerable to Ru advances in Southern regions which has been rather quiet in the past couple of weeks.

Ukr has received some long range weapons from the USA, but will those really make any difference to the eventual outcome?
IMO probably means more people die with no change in outcome.

**

Regarding the Reuters link ........ Ru. has been calling for negotiations since the beginning of this conflict.
There was an agreement in principle very early on but that was reneged on by Ukr after a visit from Boris Johnson.
Zelensky made it law that Ukr would not negotiate with Ru while Putin is in power.
Now that Zelensky's term of office has expired maybe someone can remove him and allow negotiations to begin again.

Remembering the failure of the Western countries to uphold their side of the Minsk agreements, and the most recent reneging of the 'agreement in principle', how can Ru be sure any agreement reached will be upheld?
Because of the above, I find it difficult to believe that Ru will come to an agreement with those same Western entities.

[Setanta]

It does not look like stalemate to me.
Russia has taken multiple villages & towns in the recent past and do not appear to be stopping.
In addition dues to manpower shortages, Ukr has redeployed forces from Southern regions to the North to hold the Ru advance.
That might well make the Southern regions vulnerable to Ru advances in Southern regions which has been rather quiet in the past couple of weeks.

Ukr has received some long range weapons from the USA, but will those really make any difference to the eventual outcome?
IMO probably means more people die with no change in outcome.

**

Regarding the Reuters link ........ Ru. has been calling for negotiations since the beginning of this conflict.
There was an agreement in principle very early on but that was reneged on by Ukr after a visit from Boris Johnson.
Zelensky made it law that Ukr would not negotiate with Ru while Putin is in power.
Now that Zelensky's term of office has expired maybe someone can remove him and allow negotiations to begin again.

Remembering the failure of the Western countries to uphold their side of the Minsk agreements, and the most recent reneging of the 'agreement in principle', how can Ru be sure any agreement reached will be upheld?
Because of the above, I find it difficult to believe that Ru will come to an agreement with those same Western entities.

It is effective military stalemate....russian advances are bleeding them dry for a few villages and post-industrial soviet towns.....they haven't delivered a decisive Military strike in months and their missile attacks have dried up....while behind lines air defence and supply lines are being dismantled


Theres been a massive military buildup in west Ukraine,while tens of thousands of Armenians have poured in,with the prospect of eu passport in the near future for them....the French are training massively (and something like 200 forgien legion been lost in recent weeks on the front,hence the agitation in new calie)....the likelihood of a post Olympic counter offensive is near certain,with a near certainty it'll be a international brigade..... Ukraine are throwing it's worst recruits (drunks,homeless older men etc)at a desperate defence

But I do think,they should at least begin negotiations for peace aswell

[PureIsle]

It is effective military stalemate....russian advances are bleeding them dry for a few villages and post-industrial soviet towns.....they haven't delivered a decisive Military strike in months and their missile attacks have dried up....while behind lines air defence and supply lines are being dismantled


Theres been a massive military buildup in west Ukraine,while tens of thousands of Armenians have poured in,with the prospect of eu passport in the near future for them....the French are training massively (and something like 200 forgien legion been lost in recent weeks on the front,hence the agitation in new calie)....the likelihood of a post Olympic counter offensive is near certain,with a near certainty it'll be a international brigade..... Ukraine are throwing it's worst recruits (drunks,homeless older men etc)at a desperate defence

We will agree to differ on the relative strengths of either side.

But I do think,they should at least begin negotiations for peace aswell

With whom do you suggest Ru negotiates?
Zelensky's mandate has expired.
Western govs have shown themselves to be completely untrustworthy in previous negotiations and agreements.
NATO's intent is to bring Ru to its knees.

So, who should negotiate [in good faith] with Ru.?

[knownunknown]

Russia has been brought to negociation table for ceasefire

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/pu ... 024-05-24/



Leftists,NAFO clowns,and establishment hacks across Europe, who screamed down anyone who suggested negociated peace settlements sigh in disbelief and are going to have to justify continuing a war that is at effective stalemate with over 12 months,with tens of thousands dying for minimal gains on either side

Has been a war of attrition for a long time now with front lines resembling those from WWI, trench warfare. Anyone still supporting anything but a negotiated ceasefire is just an idealist who wants to win at any cost and has no value for human life.

Anyone even proposing a ceasefire of negotiated peace is a far right putin hitler bot blah blah, etc…

[Setanta]

We will agree to differ on the relative strengths of either side.



With whom do you suggest Ru negotiates?
Zelensky's mandate has expired.
Western govs have shown themselves to be completely untrustworthy in previous negotiations and agreements.
NATO's intent is to bring Ru to its knees.

So, who should negotiate [in good faith] with Ru.?

There's no need to differ,you can acknowledge Ukraine is training ten of thousands of Armenians,and french forgien legion is active already there......the fact Ukraine is scraficing it's own in a desperate defence to buy time to train for winter offensive with outside troops/ethnic minorities is about as immoral as it comes





Seems to me,they've no choice but to negotiate with zelensky....mutterings of mandate particularly in midst of an ongoing war is leftist rubbish

Nato don't need to do anything to bring Russia to its knees,the clock is winding down on putin and either his own will take him out or bitter infighting will collapse it as a country after Putin's death.....this is how all fellows like Putin always end,as far back as Roman times.....it's why establishments across world promote via a compient media a form of democracy where you have choice of candidates,but no choice of outcomes...otherwise you need an iron fist to rule,which collapses on itself in event of perception of change/public unrest

[PureIsle]

...

Seems to me,they've no choice but to negotiate with zelensky....mutterings of mandate particularly in midst of an ongoing war is leftist rubbish

...

Except that Zelensky has made an order that Ukr cannot negotiate with Ru while Putin is in power.

Who will guarantee the deal (if struck)?

[Setanta]

A russian airfield in Luhansk is ablaze tonight.....the impact of American long range missiles is being felt massively


This is 5th large military infrastructure hit this week,well behind the front lines.....the Ukraine isn't even heavily shelling advancing forces anymore and narrative is they are rationing weapons for critical infrastructure attacks....leaving russia to slog out for villages while slowly isolating their troops there and crippling supply lines


Interesting tactic,after months of being on brink of collaspe and near overwhelmed,they might just about be getting a breath of air

[Setanta]

A core of NATO trainers and overseas troops were wiped out on the Ukraine/Poland border region last night


Hence the now openly talking of dropping of restrictions using western weapons inside Russia......a pretty major escalation in 24 hours,that has gone unnoticed

[PureIsle]

A core of NATO trainers and overseas troops were wiped out on the Ukraine/Poland border region last night


Hence the now openly talking of dropping of restrictions using western weapons inside Russia......a pretty major escalation in 24 hours,that has gone unnoticed

Unnoticed by whom? Just because MSM does not report it does not mean people are not aware of it.

Groups of foreign "trainers/advisers" have been hit previously but because they were not supposed to be there it was never admitted.
They have been managing the use of all that 'special' Western armaments since the gear got to Ukr.
Those things have been fired into 'old' Ru. territory on many occasions - Belgorod being the most noticeable in the last months.

Now that it is common knowledge that there are working foreign military personnel in Ukr NATO can use their deaths to escalate further.

NATO is bringing Europe to the brink of a widespread war, which has the potential to become a nuclear war.

[PureIsle]

Putin announced the conditions for peace with Ukraine:

First. The AFU must withdraw all troops from Donetsk, Lugansk, Kherson and Zaporozhye regions - from within their administrative boundaries. As soon as such a withdrawal of troops begins and there is a declaration of refusal of NATO aspirations from Kiev, the fire will be stopped immediately; We will immediately be ready to sit down at the negotiating table.

We are making a real, concrete peace proposal today. If they refuse it - it is their responsibility to continue the bloodshed, and the next conditions for negotiations will be different.
It is the West that wants a temporary solution to freeze the conflict. From our side, we are talking about the finalisation of the conflict.
As soon as Kiev agrees to our conditions, we are ready to start negotiations immediately.

There is no indication that I can see that this offer for peace talks stems from weakness, although some commentators are of the opinion that "the West" will see it as weakness and move to escalate further.

[Setanta]

Putin announced the conditions for peace with Ukraine:





There is no indication that I can see that this offer for peace talks stems from weakness, although some commentators are of the opinion that "the West" will see it as weakness and move to escalate further.

A international overseen DMZ in eastern Ukraine and likely Ukraine membership of NATO (but none posted in named regions),will likely be the outcome


Russia has suffered a fairly terrible kharkiv offence this last month,with upto 40,000 casualties,they are at the table for peace talks now ...it's imperative people take it seriously,a million dead for few provinces of eastern Ukraine is nuts

[Del.Monte]

A international overseen DMZ in eastern Ukraine and likely Ukraine membership of NATO (but none posted in named regions),will likely be the outcome


Russia has suffered a fairly terrible kharkiv offence this last month,with upto 40,000 casualties,they are at the table for peace talks now ...it's imperative people take it seriously,a million dead for few provinces of eastern Ukraine is nuts

Russia - no matter who is in power - will never agree to Ukraine becoming a NATO member and it's bonkers to suggest that this will be the outcome of any peace deal - not that I think that there will be a deal.

[Setanta]

Russia - no matter who is in power - will never agree to Ukraine becoming a NATO member and it's bonkers to suggest that this will be the outcome of any peace deal - not that I think that there will be a deal.

I don't think they should have any say over another country tbh....and a DMZ between the two is a reasonable compromise


What is difference between the Ukraine having NATO bases and the recently announced plans for Finnish ones?(Not that I particularly support NATO either)

[marhay70]

Russia - no matter who is in power - will never agree to Ukraine becoming a NATO member and it's bonkers to suggest that this will be the outcome of any peace deal - not that I think that there will be a deal.

Russia swore armageddon if former Eastern Bloc countries like Poland, East Germany, Romania, Czechoslovakia etc. etc, became Nato members. To date, virtually every European member of the Soviet Union has become a NATO member. The latest threat from Cousin Vlad came on the event of Sweden and Finland joining NATO. Empty threats, Russia can't back it up without using nuclear weapons and that's curtains for them, it's not believed they are even capable of launching most of their arsenal.

[Setanta]

After weeks of rinsing russian air defences and monitoring equipment,in the crimea and along the sea of avoz.... likely in anticipation of the jets to arrive in August


Today,it' dropped cluster weapons onto a beach of tourists,there's a shower of fuckers in their army,wouldn't be out of place in Russia's army

[Setanta]

Russia's kharkiv offensive may be over....it's rumoured it's had to withdraw one of its infantry brigades north of kharkiv,between logistic collapse, casualties and upto 2,000 refusing to fight,it's combat capabilities were gone in six weeks.....an absolute massive success for Ukraine, given a few months ago,its army was teetering on collaspe

[PureIsle]

Russia's kharkiv offensive may be over....it's rumoured it's had to withdraw one of its infantry brigades north of kharkiv,between logistic collapse, casualties and upto 2,000 refusing to fight,it's combat capabilities were gone in six weeks.....an absolute massive success for Ukraine, given a few months ago,its army was teetering on collaspe

A withdrawal from one relatively small position does not mean collapse of the whole line in the north and much less the whole line throughout..
Such advances and withdrawal are not uncommon. We have witnessed many such over the past couple of years.
I question your assessment that this was "an absolute massive success for Ukraine".

[Setanta]

A withdrawal from one relatively small position does not mean collapse of the whole line in the north and much less the whole line throughout..
Such advances and withdrawal are not uncommon. We have witnessed many such over the past couple of years.
I question your assessment that this was "an absolute massive success for Ukraine".

Ah lad....they've causeed a battalion of 40,000 troops to be withdrawn to restore combat capabilities,in six weeks


That is a fierce success for anyone.....it took 7months for similar losses for Wagner to capture bakhmut....a complete withdrawal of battalion sized group is unheard of in this war,and given Russia's willingness to scrafice it's own troops,points to some devastating losses...... considering Ukraine was on brink of collaspe at start of summer,it can only be regarded as success

[PureIsle]

Ah lad....they've causeed a battalion of 40,000 troops to be withdrawn to restore combat capabilities,in six weeks


That is a fierce success for anyone.....it took 7months for similar losses for Wagner to capture bakhmut....a complete withdrawal of battalion sized group is unheard of in this war,and given Russia's willingness to scrafice it's own troops,points to some devastating losses...... considering Ukraine was on brink of collaspe at start of summer,it can only be regarded as success

Yes it was a success, but not on a massive scale.
Meanwhile Ru is having success all along the combat line.

Ukr is still on the brink of collapse.
If it goes on much longer, particularly with the direct, and now obvious involvement of NATO forces, I would not be at all surprised if Ru used something 'different'.

Ru must be expecting some dirty bomb soon, after all the reports of Ukr importing material.
They might even do a pre-emptive strike with something similar.

[Setanta]

Ukraine bombing crimea with a week....Russia hits back and bombs a children hospital in middle of the day.....shower of evil fuckers

[PureIsle]

Ukraine bombing crimea with a week....Russia hits back and bombs a children hospital in middle of the day.....shower of evil fuckers

There is an alternate view of this event, including video, which purports to show a Ukr defensive missile coming down and causing the damage to the childrens hospital.
The video was apparently taken by a person in Ukr.

Now, whose propaganda do we believe?

[Setanta]

There is an alternate view of this event, including video, which purports to show a Ukr defensive missile coming down and causing the damage to the childrens hospital.
The video was apparently taken by a person in Ukr.

Now, whose propaganda do we believe?

Lad,it's the same missile Russia has used throughout the conflict to hit Kiev, any images of missiles captured in Kiev since earliest days of the war are the same,


They are a shower of fuckers,going about bombing children (any) hospitals,while claiming to hunt Nazis,leave them kids and sick people alone.

[Del.Monte]

There's a lot of people in Russia who should hold their heads in shame for allowing this war to continue - influencers and people who are big names in the world of arts. sports etc should be calling for an end to this insanity if only for the lives of their own soldiers who are being sacrificed for the fascist loons who control the country. In the rest of the world the likes of the UN, America and China should be working to bring this to a speedy end. There's no chance of the Ukraine 'winning' the war and every chance that they will drag us all into World War.III and possible extinction.