Israel and Palestine

[kadman]

It never ceases to amaze me how a bunch who detest homosexuals are still very fond of the old sodomy.

Didn't old Gadiffi get a going over just before being despatched from this world.

Wasn't it the old rulers of that part of the world that gave rise to the old saying "women are for children, boys are for fun".

And it aint just areas ruled by Ottomans.
The Afghans have an old practice called "bacha bazi".
One of the few half decent things the taliban did was execute anyone caught at it.
They claimed it too un-islamic.

And the US instructed their special forces personnel to stand down when they came across young boys being abused by Afghan military forces they had been training. Some afghan forces were severely assaulted by US special forces teams, who were subsequently punished with military justice in the US

[PureIsle]

UN chief Guterres invoked Article 99 to force the Security Council to address the war in Gaza, warning the war “may threaten the maintenance of international peace and security”.

It took way too long for him to intervene to stop the genocide in Gaza with ~16,000 murdered, a large proportion of which were children.

Lets hope this stops the killing and some solution is found before Gaza's Palestinians are fully and finally eliminated.

[PureIsle]

This includes a small video sampling of what is an ongoing murder spree by the Zionist Israeli state in the occupied territories of Gaza and West Bank.
These videos are by their nature very graphic and disturbing. I have refrained from posting any to date, but after approximately two months of murdering mayhem I have decided it is time.

[PureIsle]

https://euromedmonitor.org/en/article/6 ... rian-truce

06 Dec 2023

Geneva – Israel’s escalation of its violent bombing and deadly attacks in the Gaza Strip since last Friday, following the collapse of the one-week temporary humanitarian truce, was strongly denounced by Euro-Med Human Rights Monitor today.

Euro-Med Monitor said preliminary statistics show that the daily death toll prior to the humanitarian truce ranged between 300 and 350 deaths per day, but has now risen to more than 500 since Israel resumed its attacks for the sixth consecutive day.

This brings the total number of Palestinian deaths in the Gaza Strip since 7 October to 21,731, including 8,697 children and 4,410 women as well as those missing and trapped under the rubble who are now presumed dead. The number of injured people has also increased to 4,016.

According to Euro-Med Monitor, Israel has increased the shocking extent of its targeting of civilians since the humanitarian truce collapsed, intensifying its complete destruction of residential areas and targeting schools that house thousands of displaced individuals in an apparent effort to increase the number of civilian victims.

On a never-before-seen scale, Israel’s extensive bombing campaign has targeted both displaced civilians and civilian infrastructure, including hospitals, UN-run schools, mosques, churches, bakeries, water tanks, and even ambulances.
....

It can be no real surprise that the average death toll has increased since a large number of Palestinians were displaced from North to South Gaza and so are even more tightly packed as a consequence. Thus the 'efficiency' of the bombing (number killed or injured per bomb) has increased.

[Seafields]

This includes a small video sampling of what is an ongoing murder spree by the Zionist Israeli state in the occupied territories of Gaza and West Bank.
These videos are by their nature very graphic and disturbing. I have refrained from posting any to date, but after approximately two months of murdering mayhem I have decided it is time.

I am the opposite. Some of what I have seen on twitter will haunt me. I can't bare to look at it anymore. Children should never be subjected to the violence and destruction that has them injured, bloody and in many cases dead in those videos.

[PureIsle]

UN chief Guterres invoked Article 99 to force the Security Council to address the war in Gaza, warning the war “may threaten the maintenance of international peace and security”.

It took way too long for him to intervene to stop the genocide in Gaza with ~16,000 murdered, a large proportion of which were children.

Lets hope this stops the killing and some solution is found before Gaza's Palestinians are fully and finally eliminated.

It appears that when the draft was discussed the USA declared they would use their veto and vote against a call for a ceasefire.

I know what I think of this; make up your own minds.

[kadman]

Its because Israel is running out of munitions and has asked US to supply them. All major conflicts have always been more interested in the bottom line than any humanitarian crisis

[JayZeus]

And your source is the Government Media Office in Gaza. This is your idea of an "independent source", really? Any semblance of credibility you might have had has just gone out the window.

And as usual, radio silence.

[PureIsle]

Its because Israel is running out of munitions and has asked US to supply them. All major conflicts have always been more interested in the bottom line than any humanitarian crisis

I just read that the US is hoping to supply Israel with a large number of missiles for their Merkava tank.

Quoting a US official, Reuters reports that the Biden administration has asked Congress to approve the sale of 45,000 shells for Israel's Merkava tanks for use in its genocide in Gaza.

[Risteard]

We need to permanently expel the US ambassador as well as the so-called "ambassador" of the fake Zionist state in Palestine.

[marhay70]

We need to permanently expel the US ambassador as well as the so-called "ambassador" of the fake Zionist state in Palestine.

Who's this we of whom you speak? We didn't expel the Russian Ambassador when they continued to bomb the hell out of Ukraine or when they dropped chemical weapons on Aleppo, but you want to expel the US Ambassador for aiding one of their closest allies?
What's happening in Gaza is down to Hamas, pure and simple, they pushed it too far this time and unfortunately for the civilians of Gaza, it is they who are paying the price. Would you expect to enter the lions' den and kill their cubs and expect the lions to stand by and do nothing? Try it sometime.

[Risteard]

Who's this we of whom you speak? We didn't expel the Russian Ambassador when they continued to bomb the hell out of Ukraine or when they dropped chemical weapons on Aleppo, but you want to expel the US Ambassador for aiding one of their closest allies?
What's happening in Gaza is down to Hamas, pure and simple, they pushed it too far this time and unfortunately for the civilians of Gaza, it is they who are paying the price. Would you expect to enter the lions' den and kill their cubs and expect the lions to stand by and do nothing? Try it sometime.

It's nothing to do with Hamas. It's solely to do with the theft of Palestine by the Zionists - a terrorist act enabled and supported by the West including the so-called "UN".

Palestine shall endure forever from the river to the sea.

Biden needs to face the most extreme punishment imaginable.

[kadman]

The fact that the US is supplying most of the munitions now to facilitate the murder of women and children, no matter what the excuse is, is totally unacceptable in todays society. And the only bonus to the US is dollars.

[marhay70]

It's nothing to do with Hamas. It's solely to do with the theft of Palestine by the Zionists - a terrorist act enabled and supported by the West including the so-called "UN".

Palestine shall endure forever from the river to the sea.

Biden needs to face the most extreme punishment imaginable.

This war has nothing to do with land, Israel withdrew completely from Gaza, this war is to do with the murder and mutilation of women and children in Israel. If that hadn't happened, then this wouldn't be happening. Hamas is there, front and centre.

[marhay70]

The fact that the US is supplying most of the munitions now to facilitate the murder of women and children, no matter what the excuse is, is totally unacceptable in todays society. And the only bonus to the US is dollars.

Let's face it, that's what weapons are for, and it's rarely the ones who deserve it who suffer. Israel are an ally of the US, engaged in a war against, what the US themselves term, a terrorist organisation.

[kadman]

Let's face it, that's what weapons are for, and it's rarely the ones who deserve it who suffer. Israel are an ally of the US, engaged in a war against, what the US themselves term, a terrorist organisation.

So US vetoed the UN resolution in favour of supporting Israel killing civilians. Nothing new for the US there then.

What Hamas did to civilians was horrendous, and what Israel is now doing to civilians is equally horrendous.

There is absolutely no way we can murder civilians in a civilized world, and find a reason to support it.

[marhay70]

So US vetoed the UN resolution in favour of supporting Israel killing civilians. Nothing new for the US there then.

What Hamas did to civilians was horrendous, and what Israel is now doing to civilians is equally horrendous.

There is absolutely no way we can murder civilians in a civilized world, and find a reason to support it.

US had little choice but to veto the resolution, it wasn't going to leave Israel hanging.
This is a war game, that's not funny, between the major protagonists in the world. US is not going to walk on Israel in the same way that Russia is not going to walk on Syria and China is not going to walk on N. Korea. They represent the big powers' interests in various parts of the world.

[isha]

So US vetoed the UN resolution in favour of supporting Israel killing civilians. Nothing new for the US there then.

What Hamas did to civilians was horrendous, and what Israel is now doing to civilians is equally horrendous.

There is absolutely no way we can murder civilians in a civilized world, and find a reason to support it.

I agree.

And still find myself returning to the question - what should Israel have done in response to the mind melting atrocities done on October 7th?
Taking into account that shortly afterwards and oft repeated since, Hamas has publicly stated that they will repeat October 7th again and again and again until all Jews are gone.

What should Israel have done in response? How many people would have been considered civilised or acceptable to kill as revenge? Has someone got a number? Exactly the same maybe? Then stop and wait till the next mass rape, kidnapping and massacre event?

My mind says no people would have been acceptable to kill. Zero. No civilians deserve to die.

And yet my mind also says that raping, desecrating, murderous barbarians should be summarily eliminated from the face of the earth. I have not one atom of sympathy for those demons.

How could eliminating those who did the attack be achieved when these monsters hide amongst the civilians of Gaza? And especially among many civilians who wept with joy and cheered the atrocities and came into the street to abuse and spit on bodies of Jews.

Maybe some kind of distantly operated drone war targeting specific Hamas members like cool Obama used against the jihadists elsewhere?

I don't know. I don't know what they could have done or could yet do. I wonder what the anti-Semites think should have been the response that could have been acceptable?

[isha]

Before October 7th I was completely disgusted with settlers taking Palestinians land, the conditions in Gaza, disgusted with right wing Israeli governments, Netanyahu, I viewed Israel as a kind of despotic state, and the Zionists as cruel and racist.
I still think those things.

But after October 7th I feel loathing for the Islamic jihadists and their methods and their goals. Hard cruel cold loathing. Though I want the bombardment to stop and condemn the terrible killings of Palestinians I could never "march for Palestine". Not with Hamas there. And I also wonder what peace could ever be made with people for whom violence is a kind of religious ecstasy?

[Risteard]

This war has nothing to do with land, Israel withdrew completely from Gaza, this war is to do with the murder and mutilation of women and children in Israel. If that hadn't happened, then this wouldn't be happening. Hamas is there, front and centre.

Yes it does. The whole fake state of "Israel" is stolen Palestine, notwithstanding three illegally occupied Golan Heights which is sovereign Syrian territory.

[kadman]

I wont ever be convinced by any argument that any conflict in a theatre of war will be best served by murdering women and children who are not combatants for the benefit of the greater good. Never

[Del.Monte]

Yes it does. The whole fake state of "Israel" is stolen Palestine, notwithstanding three illegally occupied Golan Heights which is sovereign Syrian territory.

You've a very simplistic view of the world. What constitutes a 'fake' state in your eyes? States come into being and disappear for all sorts of reasons and evolution doesn't stand still. It could be argued that the Republic of Ireland is a fake state and the concept of a United Ireland the same as neither existed in the past.

[isha]

I wont ever be convinced by any argument that any conflict in a theatre of war will be best served by murdering women and children who are not combatants for the benefit of the greater good. Never

I never said that. The benefit of the greater good? That's your expression, nothing I said.

I asked what is to be done about what Hamas did? What should the Israeli government have done in response? Really. What?

[PureIsle]

While the world looks on the destruction continues.
Approx 18,000 now killed with approx 50,000 wounded.
We can add to those numbers those who are buried under the rubble of their homes.

Doctors, ambulances, aid workers and journalists amongst the dead and wounded.

I am coming to the belief that the world would be a much better place without that Zionist regime.

All of this is based on the Zionist declaration that ALL the land of Palestine plus some other parts were granted to them by their god according to some ancient text.
What a load of BS!
But it is their reason for ethnic cleansing and displacement of survivors - if they can find anywhere to go!

Without the Zionists there would be no need for Hamas, maybe then they could live in one state in peace.
It looks like a forlorn hope now, but hope is all there is presently.

[Del.Monte]

The US are the only country that can force Israel to come to their senses but despite all the nonsense shuttle diplomacy a while back that isn't going to happen.