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Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

The burning issues of the day
CelticRambler
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#276

Post by CelticRambler »

gugleguy wrote: Sat Jan 01, 2022 8:05 pm ^^^^ have the popcorn ready....;)
Hope you didn't eat it - the argument starts tomorrow. :evil:

Parcel still hasn't been delivered, but was eventually assessed, then re-assessed, for VAT and released to Parcelforce so they could send a letter through the post demanding payment ... £25.62 on a parcel worth 80€ max. Claims for reimbursement have to be sent by snail-mail to a physical Border Force address. Feckin primitives. :roll:

SonNo.2 has instructions to take photos of the parcel when it arrives, so that I can see whether or not they opened it to inspect the contents. If they did, then there's no reason for them to have charged anything, seeing as the multiple packages/multiple recipients would have been clearly visible.

Meanwhile, on the larger stage, I see that Liz Truss has been upsetting all the significant movers and shakers in the EU. Serious learning difficulties on that side of the Channel/Irish Sea. :roll:
marhay70
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#277

Post by marhay70 »

CelticRambler wrote: Sun Jan 09, 2022 9:27 pm


Meanwhile, on the larger stage, I see that Liz Truss has been upsetting all the significant movers and shakers in the EU. Serious learning difficulties on that side of the Channel/Irish Sea. :roll:

Gave me a good laugh when I heard about her threatening to trigger Article 16 t. I doubt if Liz Truss' one active brain cell could decipher the complexities of a Beano storyline, never mind the NI protocol.
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#278

Post by Banshee Bones »

Whats that say about the Urusla then, given that she managed to trigger it "by mistake"? :D
marhay70
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#279

Post by marhay70 »

Banshee Bones wrote: Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:03 pm Whats that say about the Urusla then, given that she managed to trigger it "by mistake"? :D
Wouldn't be a big fan of Ursula either but at least she has wiser heads around her, the same can't be said for Truss.
Peregrinus
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#280

Post by Peregrinus »

Banshee Bones wrote: Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:03 pm Whats that say about the Urusla then, given that she managed to trigger it "by mistake"? :D
There's a difference between, on the one hand, doing something in haste and then realising it was a mistake and reversing it and, on the other hand, and thinking very long and very hard and talking very publicly for many months about doing that thing, without mananing to acquire the first notion of what thing is or to to understand that it can't achieve what you want it to achieve.
CelticRambler
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#281

Post by CelticRambler »

Banshee Bones wrote: Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:03 pm Whats that say about the Urusla then, given that she managed to trigger it "by mistake"? :D
Doesn't say anything, seeing as only Brexiters (and their Irish fanboys) still claim/believe she triggered it. She thought aloud, was quickly put straight, admitted a "my bad" and that was the end of it.
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#282

Post by 95438756 »

So you're suggesting I wait until it goes stale!

Like Ashens on youtube trying to drink the Ale from 1935.
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#283

Post by Banshee Bones »

CelticRambler wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 7:11 am Doesn't say anything, seeing as only Brexiters (and their Irish fanboys) still claim/believe she triggered it. She thought aloud, was quickly put straight, admitted a "my bad" and that was the end of it.
Talking of fanboys are you still trying to gaslight yourself into believing that it was all just a dream ? :lol:


https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-55864442

The EU invoked Article 16 of the Northern Ireland Protocol which allows parts of the deal to be unilaterally overridden.

In a new regulation, the European Commission stated: "This is justified as a safeguard measure pursuant to Article 16 of that Protocol in order to avert serious societal difficulties due to a lack of supply threatening to disturb the orderly implementation of the vaccination campaigns in the Member States."


https://www.rte.ie/news/analysis-and-co ... es-brexit/

"The commission went into fight mode, wading into a highly public row with AstraZeneca, which lasted throughout last week. However, by Friday the vaccine issue took an explosive turn, when the commission triggered Article 16 of the Northern Ireland Protocol."
CelticRambler
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#284

Post by CelticRambler »

Banshee Bones wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 11:00 am Talking of fanboys are you still trying to gaslight yourself into believing that it was all just a dream ? :lol:
Yeah - it was all "just a dream". In the context of Astra Zeneca reneging on its contractual obligations, a concern was raised about NI being used as a backdoor for imports into the UK. A draft resolution based on the provisions of Art.16 was circulated amongst members states, as is normal, but was picked up by the British media and portrayed as the EU having already triggered Article 16. It didn't. The draft resolution was binned as soon as Ireland pointed out that it'd cause problems; there was never a final version, regardless of what the BBC or any other speculative news article said, or what the Brexiters continue to believe ... but the threat did it's job: AZ were brought to heel.
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#285

Post by Banshee Bones »

CelticRambler wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 12:19 pm Yeah - it was all "just a dream". In the context of Astra Zeneca reneging on its contractual obligations, a concern was raised about NI being used as a backdoor for imports into the UK. A draft resolution based on the provisions of Art.16 was circulated amongst members states, as is normal, but was picked up by the British media and portrayed as the EU having already triggered Article 16. It didn't. The draft resolution was binned as soon as Ireland pointed out that it'd cause problems; there was never a final version, regardless of what the BBC or any other speculative news article said, or what the Brexiters continue to believe ... but the threat did it's job: AZ were brought to heel.

So Tony Conneelly and RTE are part of the British media now?

How hard are you willing to gaslight yourself to keep believing? Probably quite hard giving your claim that the fiasco brought AZ to heel. That wound up in court and the EUs bombastic claims were quickly downgraded:lol:
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#286

Post by 6456739 »

Banshee Bones wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 1:36 pm So Tony Conneelly and RTE are part of the British media now?

How hard are you willing to gaslight yourself to keep believing? Probably quite hard giving your claim that the fiasco brought AZ to heel. That wound up in court and the EUs bombastic claims were quickly downgraded:lol:
What were the tangible effects?
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#287

Post by Banshee Bones »

ancapailldorcha wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 2:08 pm What were the tangible effects?
So you accept that Article 16 was triggered by the EU?
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#288

Post by 6456739 »

Banshee Bones wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 3:17 pm So you accept that Article 16 was triggered by the EU?
I'll take that as a "nothing".
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#289

Post by Banshee Bones »

ancapailldorcha wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 3:31 pm I'll take that as a "nothing".
There seems to be a lot of denial going on, so its good to establish just what level of reality posters are operating on, first. So do you accept that Article 16 was triggered before we move onto its effect.
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#290

Post by 6456739 »

Banshee Bones wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 4:03 pm There seems to be a lot of denial going on, so its good to establish just what level of reality posters are operating on, first. So do you accept that Article 16 was triggered before we move onto its effect.
What point, if any are you trying to make here? I saw no end of Eurosceptics' wailing when this happened despite it being a giant nothingburger.
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#291

Post by CelticRambler »

Banshee Bones wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 3:17 pm So you accept that Article 16 was triggered by the EU?
No. It was not triggered.
To tackle the current lack of transparency of vaccine exports outside the EU, the Commission is putting in place a measure requiring that such exports are subject to an authorisation by Member States.

In the process of finalisation of this measure, the Commission will ensure that the Ireland / Northern Ireland Protocol is unaffected. The Commission is not triggering the safeguard clause.

Should transits of vaccines and active substances toward third countries be abused to circumvent the effects of the authorisation system, the EU will consider using all the instruments at its disposal.

In the process of finalising the document, the Commission will also be fine-tuning the decision-making process under the implementing regulation.

The final version of the implementing regulation will be published following its adoption tomorrow.
Source: horse's mouth.
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#292

Post by Banshee Bones »

CelticRambler wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 5:53 pm No. It was not triggered.



Source: horse's mouth.
You mean when the horse realised it had made a horrible mistake and performed a complete u-turn?

How many articles from mainstream press outlets and politicians would I have to post before you'd stop pretending that article 16 was not triggered?

Laughing at Truss, when even she couldnt make a complete balls up like that and then try to pretend it never happened :lol:
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#293

Post by 6456739 »

Banshee Bones wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 8:23 pm You mean when the horse realised it had made a horrible mistake and performed a complete u-turn?

How many articles from mainstream press outlets and politicians would I have to post before you'd stop pretending that article 16 was not triggered?

Laughing at Truss, when even she couldnt make a complete balls up like that and then try to pretend it never happened :lol:
For the second time, what point are you trying to make here? What has this got to do with anything?
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#294

Post by Peregrinus »

Banshee Bones wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 8:23 pm You mean when the horse realised it had made a horrible mistake and performed a complete u-turn?

How many articles from mainstream press outlets and politicians would I have to post before you'd stop pretending that article 16 was not triggered?

Laughing at Truss, when even she couldnt make a complete balls up like that and then try to pretend it never happened :lol:
Skip the "articles from mainstream press outlets and politicians". The politicians have an agenda to push, and the newspaper reports are not necessarily wholly accurate in relation to what was, at the time, a fast-developing story. (You'll often find when you read the newspaper reports carefully that the breathless claims made in the headlines are not actually born out by the detail reported in the story.)

Actual real facts:

1. On 29 January 2021 the Commission announced that it would introduce a Regulation imposing a ban on the exporting of vaccines without a permit and, in this context, would rely on Art 16 to allow the banning of the export of vaccines to NI.

2. Uproar ensued.

3. Still on 29 January, the Commission modified its proposal. It issued a revised statement saying that it would not trigger Art 16: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... 314_EN.pdf

4. The Regulation introducing the export ban was published in the Official Journal on 30 January 2021. It did not trigger Art 16, and did not prohibit vaccine exports to NI without a permit. Instead it required exporters to report the number of vaccine doses they exported to NI. Here is a link to a .pdf of the Regulation as published in the Official Journal: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content ... LL&from=EN You can read it for yourself instead of having to rely on journalists and politicians to tell you what it says and does.

5. Conclusion: The EU said it was going to trigger Art 16 but, in the event, never did. No Regulation triggering Art 16 was ever adopted. Media reports saying that the EU was triggering Art 16 were mostly issued on 29 January between the Commission's first and second announcements. Later media reports that say the EU did trigger it are simply wrong. Policians who say that the EU triggered Art 16 are mistaken, or are lying.

I am pleased to have been able to clear this up for you. In future, Banshee, when people tell you that the EU triggered Art 16 you can tell them that they are wrong, you can give them the above links to set them right, and you can condescendingly warn them against being so gullible as to accept uncritically what Brexit enthusiasts tell them.
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#295

Post by Banshee Bones »

Peregrinus wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 2:15 am Skip the "articles from mainstream press outlets and politicians". The politicians have an agenda to push, and the newspaper reports are not necessarily wholly accurate in relation to what was, at the time, a fast-developing story. (You'll often find when you read the newspaper reports carefully that the breathless claims made in the headlines are not actually born out by the detail reported in the story.)


“The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.” :lol:

Tony Blair had an anti-EU agenda to push, or perhaps ole Barnier was a secret Brexiteer all along..


Not a single news source retracted their stories the Article 16 had been triggered, the EU never demanded correction or denied. Tony Connelly, the hero of the Irish European set reported very clearly what happened. The EU then shat itself later that evening when they realised what they had actually done and rolled back. I do recall the Euro set trying to claim it was some sort of junior admin error. It's all a bit like declaring war and then claiming that because no shots were fired that war wasnt really declared. Everyone still knows what you did :D

All very emabarassing especially when trying to crow about poor old Liz, who hasn't shown any signs of gross incompetence or memory loss so.
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#296

Post by Banshee Bones »

Banshee Bones wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 1:05 pm “The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.” :lol:

Tony Blair had an anti-EU agenda to push, or perhaps ole Barnier was a secret Brexiteer all along..


Not a single news source retracted their stories the Article 16 had been triggered, the EU never demanded correction or denied. Tony Connelly, the hero of the Irish European set reported very clearly what happened. The EU then shat itself later that evening when they realised what they had actually done and rolled back. I do recall the Euro set trying to claim it was some sort of junior admin error. It's all a bit like declaring war and then claiming that because no shots were fired that war wasnt really declared. Everyone still knows what you did :D

All very embarrassing especially when trying to crow about poor old Liz, who hasn't shown any signs of gross incompetence or memory loss so.
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#297

Post by 6456739 »

Banshee Bones wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 1:05 pm “The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.” :lol:

Tony Blair had an anti-EU agenda to push, or perhaps ole Barnier was a secret Brexiteer all along..


Not a single news source retracted their stories the Article 16 had been triggered, the EU never demanded correction or denied. Tony Connelly, the hero of the Irish European set reported very clearly what happened. The EU then shat itself later that evening when they realised what they had actually done and rolled back. I do recall the Euro set trying to claim it was some sort of junior admin error. It's all a bit like declaring war and then claiming that because no shots were fired that war wasnt really declared. Everyone still knows what you did :D

All very emabarassing especially when trying to crow about poor old Liz, who hasn't shown any signs of gross incompetence or memory loss so.
For the third time, what's your point? All I see here is nonsense and a quote that demonstrates a complete ignorance of the concept of irony.
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Banshee Bones
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#298

Post by Banshee Bones »

ancapailldorcha wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 2:09 pm For the third time, what's your point? All I see here is nonsense and a quote that demonstrates a complete ignorance of the concept of irony.
You'd ban people for that post on the politics forum on boards, if people still posted on it :lol:

See, I can attack the poster too, it's not that hard.
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#299

Post by 6456739 »

Banshee Bones wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:06 pm You'd ban people for that post on the politics forum on boards, if people still posted on it :lol:

See, I can attack the poster too, it's not that hard.
Perhaps if you actually answered the question instead of spreading fake news and being a full time victim....
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Re: Brexit is Brilliant (or is it?)

#300

Post by Peregrinus »

Banshee Bones wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 1:05 pm “The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.” :lol:

Tony Blair had an anti-EU agenda to push, or perhaps ole Barnier was a secret Brexiteer all along..


Not a single news source retracted their stories the Article 16 had been triggered, the EU never demanded correction or denied. Tony Connelly, the hero of the Irish European set reported very clearly what happened. The EU then shat itself later that evening when they realised what they had actually done and rolled back. I do recall the Euro set trying to claim it was some sort of junior admin error. It's all a bit like declaring war and then claiming that because no shots were fired that war wasnt really declared. Everyone still knows what you did :D

All very emabarassing especially when trying to crow about poor old Liz, who hasn't shown any signs of gross incompetence or memory loss so.
Banshee, if you maintain that the EU triggered Art 16, post a link to the EU Regulation triggering Article 16. That will shut us up.

If you cannot find an EU Regulation triggering Art 16, have a serious think about why that might be. And, while you are having that serious think, remain silent on the subject. That will stop you looking as gullible as you currently do.
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